Help - Skidoo sale

[Darkerfire]

Hi everyone, there goes my story.

My girlfriend's father found an interesting deal, almost too good to be true, on a gsx 1200 limited skidoo.In Quebec, the usual price of this sled is about 12,000$ brand new, and used as it is (700 miles), worth about 9,000$ CAD. The price asked on the deal is 2,600$. After getting in contact with the seller, she reply with a very typical scheme for a scam. She says her son has died from cancer and this is the reason why she wanted to sell it fast, and did not want us to ask question about this. She also mentionned she had left for vacation and she left the vehicule at an ontario company that will get it delivered to the future owner. She add that since she is in vacation, she wants a MoneyGram payment, given at the reception of the skidoo to the transportation company. After verifying the VIN, it appears clear and not stolen. BUT, a google search led me to an ebay offer that sold the exact same thing! He even had the same pictures, and the same VIN. I contacted the ebay seller, and he notified me that he had sold it, so it could not be the same person. He also told me it was probably a scam to his eyes. When asked why the same offer was on ebay, she told us that if we did not trust her, we just had to cancel the deal.

The company sent me a mail, saying that I had to reply with a scan of the MoneyGram paper but mentionned I had to hide the info's on it to make sure both parties did not get ripped off. It was to make sure I had the money ready for when they get it delivered, which is (right now) tomorrow. The transport company is in your escrow fraud site list, but dates from 2006, and the whois tells me that the site was created back in 09', so it could be a different one.

I have some more fishy stuff to add too. The girl's advert on the skidoo had copied the exact same description put on ebay, in french. That includes useless fields like "Type : --" and pictures. Plus, the info she gave me to make the moneygram to is from Togo, in Africa (she will recieve the money there). The ontario company's site, which is in French (ontario is english), says delivery are made everywhere in Europe and France. The design of the transport company has no links, no phone contact, but has called my gf's father to tell him they were coming tomorrow.

The site of the shipping's site : http://trans-logistics.net/

sadly the advert on pourvendre.ca was removed (probably by author), so all I have is the ebay one: http://cgi.cafr.ebay.ca/2009-SKI-DOO-GS ... 0602776172 (this guy is likely not a scammer btw)

Is this a scam? Even though the company asks the money AFTER getting it delivered?
I also heard moneygram was very easy to use for frauding because it's hard to retrace people you don't know with it. I'm not used to finding fraud sites and stuff, that's why I posted here to know if you guys had any hookups, thanks alot in advance. I'll post back if nobody reply before tomorrow to keep you informed.

[lightfair]

Hello,

it sure has all the signs of a scam. What I don't completely understand is this part:

The company sent me a mail, saying that I had to reply with a scan of the MoneyGram paper but mentionned I had to hide the info's on it to make sure both parties did not get ripped off. It was to make sure I had the money ready for when they get it delivered, which is (right now) tomorrow.

So, essentially you are supposed to send the money by Moneygram to the alleged "seller" in Togo; and then you are supposed to scan in the receipt and mail it to the "shipping company" so they can be sure you have the money ready when they deliver? But you won't have it ready then - you already sent it!

I'm not completely sure about the web site involved here; but one thing is sure: The white van on top of that page has the logo photoshopped into it very badly. I also find it remarkable that a number of the pictures on the front page are cute animals (just reload the page a few times); and the other pictures are coming from other (existing) transport companies. Also when looking at the pictures and the Flash animation I get the feeling that the company should be based in France.

A bit of digging leads to this site: http://www.road-express.fr/ (which is probably completely legit); I'm sure you'll notice that http://trans-logistics.net/ has copied the picture of the vans and then photoshopped their own logo into it (quite badly, as I said).

So I guess things should be a bit clearer now. I am not that familiar with MoneyGram - but Western Union apparently pays out the money even if the receiver doesn't have the MTCN (the transfer number) as long as name, address and amount match. I wouldn't be surprised if MoneyGram did the same - which essentially means that the receiver will get the money immediately once you have sent it (especially if the receiver might work together with a MoneyGram employee). So don't even think about sending any money!

Everything (including the bad Photoshop job, using pictures from France instead of French Canada and the MoneyGram receiver in Togo) smells in my opinion strongly of african scammers.

[Darkerfire]

Hello,

it sure has all the signs of a scam. What I don't completely understand is this part:

The company sent me a mail, saying that I had to reply with a scan of the MoneyGram paper but mentionned I had to hide the info's on it to make sure both parties did not get ripped off. It was to make sure I had the money ready for when they get it delivered, which is (right now) tomorrow.

So, essentially you are supposed to send the money by Moneygram to the alleged "seller" in Togo; and then you are supposed to scan in the receipt and mail it to the "shipping company" so they can be sure you have the money ready when they deliver? But you won't have it ready then - you already sent it!

I'm sorry if I didn't make myself clear there, trans-logistics asked for a scan of my MoneyGram "money" that I'll have paid for at the post-office. It's the equivalent of a check, but in an internet currency like paypal.
About that van copied and photoshopped, very nice observation: you can even see the blurry white of the other logo removal. I have read about african scams online and it's quite obvious, now that you mention it. I'll have to inform the police about this issue because it's nothing I've seen here before.

[lightfair]

I'm sorry if I didn't make myself clear there, trans-logistics asked for a scan of my MoneyGram "money" that I'll have paid for at the post-office. It's the equivalent of a check, but in an internet currency like paypal.

That's clear to me. However what we need to keep in mind is that once you have paid the money into the MoneyGram system ("sent a MoneyGram", so to speak) it can be cashed by the receiver within about 10 to 15 minutes. There is no need for the receiver to know the reference number or present the receipt. That's what this service (and similarly Western Union) is designed for. So the "company" (read: the scammer) just wants to be sure you have sent the money so he can cash it immediately.

The scheme is a bit primitive but very similar to the well-known Western Union scheme where the scammer asks you to send a scan of the receipt but to omit the MTCN (the reference number). Most people assume that means the money can't be cashed and hence is safe - but that's not true.